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Peter Weissbach: An Interview With Joni Dourif & Dane Spotts



The following is a transcript of a radio interview
that was recorded on Thursday, July 12, 2001.
Joni Dourif and Dane Spotts discuss the new TRV
Training Course and the Chandra Levy missing
persons case with host Peter Weissbach.


Weissbach: Thank you for joining me tonight on The Quest. You know, the first time I came across remote viewing was in the mid-eighties. And it happened when I interviewed Russell Targ and Keith Harary. They were the co-authors of the book called The Mind Race. And they talked about this whole new area that I was totally ignorant of. But they talked about the fact that behind the then Iron Curtain, there was research going on, to be able to be in one location, but remote view something thousands of miles away. And they also went on to say that there had been research done for the U.S. government, in remote viewing. So I found it fascinating. It has of course come a long, long way. Tonight I am pleased to be joined by Joni Dourif and Dane Spotts. They head up an organization called PSI TECH. And they have a new course that you came out with, that is just wonderful. Good evening to both of you.

Dane Spotts: Hi there, Peter.

Jonina Dourif: Hi.

The Generation II TRV Training Course


Weissbach: Hi. Thank you. I previewed as much as much as I could of this course, but it's first class.

Jonina Dourif: It's rather extensive.

Weissbach: You must have put a few bucks into producing that.

Jonina Dourif: Well, you know, our company is called PSI TECH. And we actually are the company who brought this out of the confines of the military. I heard you mentioning Russell Targ and Keith Harary. They were actually on the research side of the house. What happened shortly after they wrote that book, is that there was a breakthrough discovery involving Hal Puthoff, who is one of the world's leading physicists, and one of the world's most phenomenal psychics, Ingo Swann, were working on a separate operation, under the Defense Intelligence Agency. They were given $50,000 to come up with a method by which to train people to psychic, in fact, to be accurate. A few months went by, and they were getting nowhere. And so finally Ingo said to Hal, Let me just go home and, Hal threw his hands up in the air and said, Okay. Well, what Ingo did is, he went home, and being born a natural psychic, and a very good one - he was the one who predicted the downfall of the Berlin Wall, by the way, two years before it happened. He went home and studied his own psychic process and documented it, and came back. And then he and the physicist got only five people, and this was a very classified top secret unit, and it only involved five people now, that went on afterwards. And that did not involve Russell Targ, or Keith Harary, or Stephen Schwartz, or any of these other people who were on the research side of the house. So, we're talking about two different things. That book is very informative about the research. But the actual application of it…

Weissbach: Of course, I was talking about the fact that being aware that this was even possible. But anyway, let's move ahead in your…

Jonina Dourif:  Right. And so,

Weissbach: Hold it, hold it, hold it, hold it. I remember this from the last time, Joni.

Jonina Dourif: (Laughs)

Weissbach: You're going to have to follow my lead. Because if we go with you, all we're going to do is get a little bit of information in. And I've got to touch, by necessity, because of time constraints, on a number of things.

Dane Spotts: Ten hours crammed into five minutes.

Weissbach: Yeah, I know. But you re married now, aren't you?

Dane Spotts: We are married.

Jonina Dourif: Yeah

Weissbach: You see, now, Dane, I hope you get your two minutes worth in once in a while.

Dane Spotts: She doesn't let me.

Weissbach: (Laughs)

Jonina Dourif: No, that s not true. You think I'm a professional at (radio interviewing), actually I'm not. Our company has been operating in a clandestine way for many years. We just recently went public with Dane.

Weissbach: I understand.. All right, the company is PSI TECH. We ll get a bit more into the course that you have available by video in a moment. But I'm interested in finding out, Dane, now how did you get into this?

Dane Spotts:  Well, actually, I've been in the mind development business for about twenty years.

Weissbach: Yeah.


Dane Spotts: I've been involved in a number of different ventures. In all of them, the underlying mission of those ventures was the evolution of consciousness. And, PSI TECH and Technical Remote Viewing happen to be The Holy Grail of that.

Weissbach: Now, have you done this? Do you remote view, yourself?

Dane Spotts: I do. Yes.

Weissbach: Now, did it take you long?

Dane Spotts: I have an excellent trainer. She's sitting a few feet away from me.

Weissbach: Joni trained you how to do this. Did it take long?

Dane Spotts:  It did take a few months. This is something that doesn't happen over night. The training system we developed teaches both the unconscious and the conscious mind. And so the conscious mind is brand new to this. So it does take some time to actually install the skill.

Weissbach: So, Joni, if I were to sit down with your course, how much do I have to put in every day. Do I have to do this every day?

Jonina Dourif: The company's videotaped training course? It depends on how much you apply this yourself. This is a learned skill. So, it's similar to martial arts. The more you do it, the better you get. Doing it once a day or say four times a week…

Weissbach:  Now, you're very accomplished at this.

Dane Spotts: Yes. Actually, Joni's a little modest.

Weissbach: Yeah, you're very accomplished at this. So, when you sit down, and do something like this. I mean, are you looking at it like I would be looking at something on a television screen?

Jonina Dourif: No, in fact, the attitude which is most optimal for effective remote viewing, is a I don't care it's rather a robotic attitude, where you're pretty much just operating autonomically, automatically, staying in structure. And writing everything down. It's a robotic process so…

Weissbach: I know.. are you seeing? Are you seeing the site?

Dane Spotts: I think that's a misnomer. People think they are actually going out-of-body and actually physically going some place, visually identifying something. It doesn't work like that.

Jonina Dourif: Now, visuals are a part of it, but they're only fleeting. We use all of our senses: our hearing, our taste, our smell, our visuals, our thoughts even, everything. So, we're using all of them.

Dane Spotts: The actual breakthrough, here, and this actually is a phenomenal breakthrough that was made. It was made years ago and it's been refined by PSI TECH throughout the years is the ability to break down this downloaded data stream, that comes from the collective unconscious. And what Technical Remote Viewing basically does, is it separates out that raw data package from your imagination. And that's really what the brilliance of this whole technique is about. So, it's not so much that you re flying around, visualizing things, but you re grabbing that downloaded package of information. You're able to train, then, very specifically, in a very structured manner, how to separate out those data parts from imagination.

Weissbach: And you're saying that anybody, literally, anybody, with the right training, can access this.

Dane Spotts: We're born with this ability. It's an innate ability and really what this training does, is to develop what we call that psi muscle to be able to grab that data package, and then using this very structured systematic methodology, to be able to separate out those specific data parts.

Jonina Dourif: Very much like learning how to speak a language. We all could make noises but then we had to learn how to speak to communicate in a refined way. So, anybody who could make a noise, could basically learn a language.

Weissbach: Now, let me ask you this. This technology was worked on, or this technique, for the purposes of spying..

Jonina Dourif: Yes.

Dane Spotts: That's exactly correct.

Jonina Dourif: Yes, it was.

Weissbach: So, are you saying that, let's suppose.. I may have asked you this last time, but anyway, let's suppose a pervert, you know, wants to become a peeping tom and gets a hold of your course here, and he's flipping around through bedrooms throughout the United States.

Jonina Dourif: I know. This is a question everybody asks, of course. And it's a scary thing, because, until you start doing it, you don't understand that it's not something like that. Now, I can only tell you my experience. And PSI TECH has had the most experience, from training people. We've trained more people in this technology, than anybody. So, to date, we have the most data collected. People who come to learn this skill for those purposes end up leaving with that being the last thing on their mind. Because it expands your horizons and you realize how much there is to know. And suddenly you become very small in this huge universe. And being a peeping Tom is the last thing you're interested in, you're just not interested in it anymore.

Dane Spotts: But that's not to say that someone wouldn't want to learn this for financial gain or for self-improvement purposes, or for their own industrial intelligence activities.

Weissbach: All right. Now, you've done some stuff and you've actually been hired by some people to do that kind of stuff.

Jonina Dourif: That's been the majority of our income up until we made the tapes, yes. We weren't public at all about it.

Weissbach:  You've been doing some, I gather you have been, Joni, doing some remote viewing with respect to the big case that's out there now the Condit/Chandra Levy case.

Dane Spotts: It's actually the Chandra Levy case.

Weissbach: Chandra Levy Case.

Jonina Dourif: We were going to announce it on your show.

Weissbach: You are eh..

Dane Spotts: You get the big scoop tonight.

Weissbach: All right. Well, I'm going to go for a break first. They call this a cliffhanger. So hold on. Now, I do have your web site here, where people can go check out what you have to offer, and find out more stuff, in terms of remote viewing. It's remoteviewing.com. Is there also a phone number?

Dane Spotts: Our phone number is 1-888-242-4245. We've actually put together a video documentary on the company and the technology. And for the first one hundred callers, we'll send it out for free.

Weissbach:  We are joined tonight by Joni Dourif and Dane Spotts. They run PSI TECH and they are pros at remote viewing. Now, Chandra Levy, Joni, you've been doing some work on this?

Jonina Dourif:  Yes.

Dane Spotts: Actually, the company has. Dourif. Yes.

Dane Spotts: We decided to make it a company project.

Weissbach: So there's more than just Joni involved in this…

Dane Spotts: A number of remote viewers.

Jonina Dourif: About six.

Weissbach: All right. So what have you been able to come up with?

Jonina Dourif: Well, number one, Chandra Levy is dead. We have located her body and it is wrapped in sort of a rubber thing, or, we couldn't ascertain yet, because, you understand, we are collecting data bit by bit. But it's inside something lying wedged in shallow water. And an agent was used for rapid decomposition of her body. The body location is in a dark, gloomy, desolate terrain near a passageway where we hear foghorns or train horns, and birds are the main silence breakers.

Weissbach: Now when you say birds - like Seagulls?

Jonina Dourif: No. Actually they sound more like crows. But the remote viewers got all of those sounds as the main sounds.

Weissbach: So, this is in the present that you're going to that. Is it possible, through remote viewing, to go back to the point where she was murdered?

Jonina Dourif: Yes, let me get to that. I'm not finished with our report.

Weissbach: Okay. I'll be quiet.

Jonina Dourif: That was three, this is four. There are indicators that Chandra was in the early state of pregnancy. Okay, so that was the first probe. That was our initial probe. That was the information that the remote viewers came up with.

Weissbach: When did you do that probe?

Jonina Dourif: ..on our third session that took forty five minutes for each remote viewer to do that.

Weissbach: What day? How long ago?

Jonina Dourif:  Two days ago.

Weissbach: Because today, you know, The National Enquirer, it's reported on the Drudge Report, that The National Enquirer is going to break this story that she was pregnant.

Jonina Dourif: I didn't know that.

Weissbach: And that she claims that Congressman Condit was the father, that she claimed this to a couple of friends

Dane Spotts: Here's the bombshell coming up, here. Go ahead Joni.

Jonina Dourif: So yesterday, we did more work and went in with the cue Chandra Levy/Cause of death. And all the remote viewers came up with three definite items. That she died by suffocation. And the murderer was a young Caucasian appearing man in his twenties with very short hair. And then, the other thing was, Chandra s death was a deliberate act. It was not an accident. That was very surprising, of course, because, a lot of us were front loaded with the idea that Gary Condit had actually done the murder. And all of the remote viewers came up with the same data that this was a younger man. We don't know yet if he was directed to do this by somebody else. But we are continuing to work on it and will find out that data.

Weissbach: So, how detailed does this become. When you say, we continue to work at it and we will get more data. Now, why is it that the more you do this, and the longer you do this, the more information comes in?

Jonina Dourif: Imagine you have a telescope and you can use that telescope to see some event, person, place or thing, in the past, present or future. And really all you're seeing at one time is just that radius of what the telescope is seeing. So that's why it's always advantageous to use more than one remote viewer because then you have, say, six telescopes. And then when their sessions come in, it pieces together like a perfect puzzle. That's why there is so much work involved. Each session is like a telescope view.

Weissbach: All right. So when you are going through this and picking up these impressions. Now, are you feeling, for instance, the terror or what Chandra Levy might have been feeling when this person was trying to kill her? Do you pick up on that kind of..

Jonina Dourif: Well, this is something in the early days when we were training professionals, we had to actually target them against, say, the ovens of Dachau, to desensitize them from that kind of trauma. Because, yes, at first you become overwhelmed with the feelings because one of the senses that we use to gather this information are our own emotions. So, it s really a matter of desensitizing yourself. And going on it like you re on the mission. In fact, I tell my trainees, I say, regard it as though you're a spy on a mission.

Weissbach:  Okay. This is pretty.. I mean, you can go out on a limb like this.

Dane Spotts: This is going out on a limb.

Weissbach: And if tomorrow she comes…

Jonina Dourif: I ve done so many of these.

Dane Spotts: We're pretty definite of the data.

Weissbach: But I mean, this is kind of risky. Because if you're wrong, your credibility is shot, right?

Jonina Dourif: I haven't been wrong about a missing person yet and I've been doing this for years.

Weissbach: You're just really confident about this.

Dane Spotts: She's pretty modest. She's the best remote viewer in the world.

Weissbach: The best remote viewer in the world…

Dane Spotts: The best remote viewer in the world.

Jonina Dourif: Oh, I don t know about that.

Weissbach: So, can you get into the future, as well?

Jonina Dourif: Yes.

Weissbach: So could you, for instance, try to determine whether or not they will ever apprehend the person or find the body?

Jonina Dourif: Yes, we could. It would take a lot of work.

Weissbach: It would?

Jonina Dourif: Probably. I can only guess. It depends on if it s a very definite thing that is absolutely there in the future. Let's say that our main suspect commits suicide, and that's already set in motion in the future. That wouldn't be difficult for the remote viewers to pick up. But, there are still variables out there. So, what the remote viewer would pick up, if there were a lot of variables, are the variables.

Weissbach: And so, what you're saying is, from what you are picking up, you and your remote viewers, this was a premeditated murder?

Dane Spotts: Yes. Correct.

Jonina Dourif: Well, it was deliberate. I hesitate to use the word premeditated, because that did not come up in the data, but deliberate…

Weissbach: Well putting something in a bag, and rapidly decomposing, you must have this kind of chemical with you..

Jonina Dourif: This kid, had a like a sloppy shirt on. I mean, it was the kind of kid you would expect to see out on the streets - 21, 22 year old.

Weissbach: So, you're going to be able to go back to see what happened. Because the interesting part, is, of course, that the only thing that was missing is her apartment key. And all her things were packed in the apartment. And the apartment was locked.

Dane Spotts:  Actually, Peter, depending on how much work we wanted to invest into this, we could go down and pick up every single detail and aspect.

Weissbach: You're that confident of it?

Dane Spotts: But it would take an enormous amount of work. A lot of people just assume that you just look at it and you're able to pull out all this data. This is like solving a math problem, a complex math problem. It involves a tremendous amount of energy and effort. And Joni, the remote viewers, are exhausted after completing a single session.

Weissbach: All right. Well, listen, you guys stand by. We've got more to come of course. Joni Dourif, Dane Spotts of PSI TECH, remote viewing. We're going to touch a bit on their course too, which I've gone through, just on a cursory basis. But, it's really well done. I gotta tell you. It's well done. I mean, this is kind of mind-boggling information, in terms of them having looked at the Chandra Levy situation. And Joni just came out and said she's dead. She was murdered. It was planned.

Weissbach: Remote Viewing. It is a learned skill, according to our guests. And they say that they have a course that can teach you how to do it. They run an organization called PSI TECH. Joni Dourif, who, according to her partner, Dane Spotts here, is the best remote viewer in the world. She's with us as well as Dane Spotts is with us as well. Let me go to the phone lines. Let's go to Dave. Welcome to The Quest, Dave. Dave: The remote viewing, I don't slough it off as nonsense, but, it seems to me, correct me if I'm wrong, that our CIA spent, I would say millions of dollars investigating this, and they were in competition with the KGB, and a lot of tax payer dollars went into this, and then they just kind of gave it up as…

Weissbach:  Well Joni, you could probably address this.

Dane Spotts: Actually they spent twenty million dollars on this specific technology. Now Joni, why don't you tell them exactly how that happened?

Jonina Dourif: It's a little bit difficult to understand the history of remote viewing unless you understand the military intelligence system. The CIA was responsible for the research portion of psychic research in the seventies, but the CIA let go of it and then passed it on to the Defense Intelligence Agency. And they were the ones that came up with the actual application that PSI TECH, and PSI TECH only by the way, teaches the application that was the structure where anybody off the street could learn how to do this.

Dane Spotts: That was the breakthrough. That's what cost the twenty million.

Jonina Dourif: And, PSI TECH brought it out of the military by a few who did not want to see this technology lost when it became corrupted, the small unit that it was, became corrupted by the political system in the late eighties. So, we brought it out into the private sector, thus, making it public as well.

Weissbach:  Now, in Toronto, Ontario we have Barbara standing by. Welcome to The Quest. Go ahead.

Barbara: Hello.

Weissbach:  Hi.

Barbara: Sorry, I'm a little nervous.

Weissbach: Well that's all right.

Barbara: I'm a remote viewer. I've taken the course.

Weissbach:  Ohhh..

Barbara: And, specifically the PSI TECH course. It actually does work.

Weissbach:  How long did it take you to get there?

Barbara: Well, I was practicing consistently for like a year, and I had a pretty good track record with it.

Weissbach:  And so, what do you use it for?

Barbara: Well, I use it for various things. Sometimes, just finding a key. Or, finding an answer for a problem. It could be used for various applications.

Weissbach:  Can you make money with it?

Barbara: That was not my goal. That wasn't the purpose.

Jonina Dourif: Barbara doesn't need to make money. (Laughs)

Weissbach:  Barbara has money?

Jonina Dourif: I've never actually heard her voice. Hi.

Barbara: Hi.

Jonina Dourif: Actually, she's one of the training students who have been an active participant in our chat room in our bulletin boards, for over four years now. She's quite good and she learned it from the tapes and from being an active participant online.

Barbara: The tapes are very very easy to use.

Weissbach: Barbara, thank you very much for your call. Appreciate it.

Jonina Dourif: Thanks for calling.

Weissbach: So, Barbara uses it to find keys or solve problems. Could I use it to time the market?

Jonina Dourif: Yes. Actually, we have one remote viewer in Oregon who is adamant to use this for the stock market. That is a bit more difficult because of the nature of psychic processing. It's a bit difficult to ascertain numbers.

Dane Spotts: But you know the real way to make money from this, Peter, is people can use this to go into the future to forecast business, trends, to explore future technologies, to be able to look for specific catalyst technologies or methodologies, or systems, that they particularly happen to be working with. It's been used for that. PSI TECH's actually been hired by some very large industrial companies as clients.

Jonina Dourif: The largest gold company in the world.

Weissbach: So, let me get this straight here, Dane. So what you re saying is, I can kind of scan into the future and see what kind of technology is there..

Dane Spotts: That's exactly correct.

Weissbach: But if I do that, aren't I ripping somebody off?

Jonina Dourif: It could be looked at that way.

Weissbach: (Laughs)

Jonina Dourif: We were accused of that back in 1993 by someone who said we were conducting industrial espionage, because we came up with a technology that the Japanese were working on, but we didn't know that.

Dane Spotts: That was GPS . The Global Positioning Systems for automobiles.

Jonina Dourif: We picked it up from remote viewing. But because it was being developed, and they actually hadn't really come up, it was actually using GPS for specifically in cars, a certain type of system.

Weissbach: Right.

Dane Spotts:  People have used this for finding buried treasure. For looking for large mineral deposits. Gold, oil, that sort of thing.

Weissbach:  How is this going to work… so, somehow I can go into the future is what you're saying?

Dane Spotts: Actually, it's not really you're going into the future, what you're actually doing is you re accessing a library, called the Collective Unconscious, and you're pulling down a reference book that deals with that particular target or cue that you've targeted.

Weissbach:  But, it seems to me, that you have to be almost a fatalist then. I mean, if you say that I can look into the future, that means you must be a fatalist that everything is predetermined.

Jonina Dourif: No, it's not.

Dane Spotts: We call it a trajectory.

Jonina Dourif: In fact, just from many years of experience of doing trajectories, that's what we call them, for different people, the fact is that we're all very unique. Some of us do have set destinies, and some of us don't.

Weissbach: Okay. Now let me ask you this. On this Chandra Levy, that you, Joni, and the five other remote viewers are getting into this case, do you say, that she's dead, that she was murdered?

Jonina Dourif: Yes.

Weissbach: It wasn't an accident. That she's encased in some kind of bag, I guess. And that something's been added, chemically, to decompose the body as quickly as possible. Now, what do you do with that? What do you do with that information, anything?

Dane Spotts: That's a good question. Because, we have worked with police agencies in the past. And some are accepting of this kind of data. Others are not.

Weissbach: Will you send this on to the D.C. cops?

Jonina Dourif: Somebody has already done it, I'm sure. Most of the missing persons cases that we have conducted in the past have been strictly for the FBI and so it was all proprietary. We couldn't talk about it and it was rather frustrating because we never got credit for it. And that's not, of course, the only reason why we did it. We did it because of the interest to do it. But this is not something that you want to do every day.

Weissbach:  Now, why do you say that?

Jonina Dourif:  It's difficult.

Weissbach: What makes it difficult?

Jonina Dourif: Because of the trauma. The trauma involved. It's not really something that you want your unconscious spending a lot of time on. Murder.

Dane Spotts: In fact, what most people actually use this skill for, is to map out their own personal futures - something we call Optimum TrajectoriesTM.

Weissbach: I understand. But I just want to finish out this because I find this fascinating, of course. As probably everybody listening is finding it fascinating. If you were to spend more time at this. Are you saying that, ultimately, you think you could kind of identify the murderer, and also identify the motive?

Dane Spotts: Yes.

Weissbach: Could you see if this person was a front person for somebody else?

Jonina Dourif: What we could do is describe the person. We can't come up with his name if it's not Gary Condit,

Weissbach: Right.

Jonina Dourif: And we can probe Gary Condit's mind to find out if it's him, which we intend to do.

Weissbach: Wow.

Jonina Dourif:  But, if it wasn't him behind the actual murder, then we can come up with a very accurate description of the person where they work, how they look, how tall they are, how much they weigh, and their personality type. But no, we can't come up with a name.

Weissbach: Okay. We're going to get into Optimum TrajectoriesTM.

Jonina Dourif: Can I just mention one thing about missing people?

Weissbach: Yeah.

Jonina Dourif: My favorite missing people to do are runaway teenagers because, they're hardly ever dead and they usually want to be found.

Weissbach: So it's easier that way and it's a happier ending too. All right. Stand by. Our guests are the people that operate PSI TECH, Joni Dourif and Dane Spotts. Remote viewing, and they have put together quite, and I'm going to talk a bit about this program that they've put together on video. And their web site. You ought to write this down. It's psitech.net. Their phone number is 1-888-242-4245. That' s their business number. You're on The Quest. This is Weissbach.

Weissbach: We are discussing remote viewing tonight on The Quest. Joni Dourif and Dane Spotts, run an organization by the name of PSI TECH. Next, in Dayton Ohio, we have Tom listening to us on WHIO.

Tom: I had a question for them. I'm thinking this is mainly a mental ability. You have to really use a lot of your mental ability.

Dane Spotts:  This is a skill that is installed into your mind and you're using both your unconscious and your conscious processes to do it. We use the term bilocated when you're actually doing it.

Tom: Okay. Because, one of the main questions I had is, are there medications that hamper or increase this ability? Like if you're taking something, like if you have a learning disability. You know what I m saying? Is that…

Jonina Dourif: Tom?

Tom: Yeah.

Jonina Dourif: You are correct in saying that it's a mental ability, or a mental skill. We are using our mind but we're also using our senses that involve our body. The only medications that would interfere with remote viewing are mood altering medications like alcohol and the only one drug, actually, that we have seen, that long term use has actually affected remote viewers, throughout, is marijuana.

Tom: Oh, okay. I was thinking things like Thorazine or stuff like that.

Jonina Dourif: Well Thorazine, it's pretty hard to stay awake on that isn't it? You have to have an alert mind. We have trainees who take some antidepressants and things like that. And as long as they reach a normalized stable state, and have an alert mind, they can do it.

Weissbach: All right, Sir. Thank you very much for your call. Call me again. Next in Seattle listening to KOMO AM 1000, we have Madeline. Welcome to The Quest.

Madeline: After listening to all of this all I can say is it s a crock of blizey. And a crock of blizey is ten pounds of fertilizer in a five pound bag. Goodbye.

Jonina Dourif: (Laughs) Well Peter,

Dane Spotts:  At least she's got an opinion.

Jonina Dourif: Peter, this is why I distance PSI TECH from what has become the popular buzz word of remote viewing. Because, ever since we created the market, people realized it was becoming popular, and jumped on the bandwagon. And so now there s a lot of, I hate to use the word, but there's a lot of what's the word that you want to use, Dane?

Dane Spotts: Unskilled instead of Charlatans?

Jonina Dourif: Unskilled people out there who really don't know what this skill is at all and who are advertising themselves as remote viewers and they have no idea what they are doing.

Weissbach: Okay. Let's move on to the next caller here. Marielle, welcome to The Quest. Go ahead.

Marielle: Yes. On the Chandra Levy case, she has said, that she had some wonderful news to tell. And I was thinking, that she was pregnant?

Jonina Dourif: Really?

Marielle: Well, she had said to her Aunt that she had some wonderful news to tell.

Jonina Dourif:  I didn't know that. I purposely didn't watch the news before I remote viewed it.

Weissbach: We'll move on to Alberto here. Welcome to The Quest Alberto.

Alberto: Thank you. I was wondering. How long does it typically take somebody to master this remote viewing course that you offer.

Jonina Dourif: It depends on how much they throw themselves into it and how determined they are. It can take anywhere from two weeks to three months depending..

Weissbach: On how much time, right.

Jonina Dourif: Right.

Weissbach: The Optimum TrajectoryTM, what is that?

Jonina Dourif: That is a term that we created for somebody's ultimate life path, so to speak.

Weissbach: How does remote viewing help me to achieve that?

Jonina Dourif: What happens is, when people begin to learn this skill, the more and more they learn, they can look at more refined detailed things about themselves, in the future and their life. They start to wonder, Is there a future that is out there for me that is optimum, where I can really be the happiest I could be? And, there is. We call it the Optimum Trajectory.

Weissbach: And how do I get that?

Jonina Dourif: And when you remote view that you never know what you re going to get.

Weissbach: So you remote view that consciously.

Dane Spotts: We cue it. It actually becomes a target.

Jonina Dourif: Yes. It would be a front loaded target unless somebody gave it to them as a blind.

Weissbach: What does that mean - a front loaded target?

Jonina Dourif: Front loaded means you know what you're remote viewing. Like on the Chandra Levy case, for example. Dane and I knew what we were remote viewing. However, the five other remote viewers did not. They only had a set of numbers. And they came up with the same data and some corresponding data that we did. We knew what we were remote viewing. They didn't. So we had five other peoples' data to compare ours with.

Weissbach: So when you say you just gave them a number, what do you mean, just gave them a number?

Jonina Dourif: Eight numbers.

Dane Spotts: Those are just coordinates.

Weissbach: Coordinates. Oh, I see.

Dane Spotts: We call them Target Reference NumbersTM.

Weissbach: Target Reference Numbers. And so, these Target Reference Numbers would say, Chandra Levy, except the person doing the remote viewing wouldn't know that.

Jonina Dourif: The person doing the remote viewing only needs to know to stay in remote viewing structure. The Target Reference Numbers represent, metaphorically, the title of a book. Now, this is our theory of how it works, obviously. The title of the book that exists on, say, Chandra Levy, that is present in the Collective Unconscious, like a blueprint. Every person is an event, so to speak,

Weissbach: I understand.

Jonina Dourif: Like a book. I would cue it Chandra Levy and assign it eight numbers and set up a folder and then just give my five remote viewers the eight numbers.

Weissbach: All right. Unfortunately, we are out of time. You have a video documentary on PSI TECH that you'll send out free to the first hundred callers.

Dane Spotts: We do. That will show them exactly how this works and the history of the company.

Weissbach: And talks about your company and also the video course that you have. And it s 1-888-242-4245.

Dane Spotts: That's correct.

Weissbach: Also, more information is available at the website, which is remoteviewing.com. Well listen, I appreciate the time, and of course, isn't enough time. We'll have to do this again. But it's fascinating and I've certainly made notes here of what you've said Joni about the Chandra Levy situation and I'll be tracking it.

Jonina Dourif: Okay.

Weissbach: And listen, thank you so much. And Dane Spotts, thank you as well.

Dane Spotts: Very good. Thank you.

Weissbach: All right. Good night.

Jonina Dourif: Good night.